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Around SBN: Explaining Jeremy Lin's Early, Surprising Success

Sell, Sell, Sell

Get the Best for What's Left

Last night was the final straw.  I can't watch any more of this crap brand of hockey that masquerades as the Colorado Avalanche.  The last few games have shown me something about this team.  That thing?  They aren't ready to return to the playoffs.  Nothing I've seen in the last few games has given me any hope that there is the ability or desire to right the ship.  As Thomas said in the open thread for last night's game, everybody is standing around waiting for the style of hockey they've been playing to start winning games, when all evidence points to it not happening.

My theory is that the players gave up over a month-and-a-half ago when the last of the Three Essess went down.  Only the energetic play of the call-ups and Theo's Holy Grail-level quest to earn a paycheck next season kept the secret from getting out. Jibbles has a great post about this too.  I'll second everything he says. The lack of commitment starts with the coaching staff and has trickled down to the guys in the press-box.

It's time for a soft reboot of this team.  IMO, everybody but Lappy, Guite, Wolski, Stastny, Leopold, Finger, Jones, Hensick, and McCormick are fair game for trades.  Don't gut the core of the team or sell the future, but changes have to be made.  Bruno, Arny, Liles, Hejduk, McLeod, both goalies, Hannan, Clark, Skratch (please, dear god, let the Kings take him off our hands), etc. have not contributed to this team being playoff caliber.  

Of course, a significant change in personnel won't mean jack squat if Mediocre Quenneville is allowed to retain his job.  He and his entire staff (including the correspondence-school educated trainers) should be shown the door.  He's never won anything, he makes horrible personnel decisions, he can't coach star-quality players worth a damn, and his in-game 'strategy' often blows up in his face.  He's shown a lack of commitment to the players he's had for a significant stretch of his stay in Colorado, and hasn't figured out how to utilize the newer additions to the lineup.  The fact that the worst PP in the history of the team (with some of the best players since the golden days) has happened under his watch is enough to have the door hit him on the way out.

I'm seriously considering not watching the remainder of the games this season.  I get to see horrible hockey every Sunday night with my beer-league team.  Why would I spend more time watching another group of players with more skill and less desire play WORSE than my group of guys (and that saying something as we got shelled 13-1 Sunday night!)?  The Avs organization from top to bottom hasn't done ANYTHING in the last 6-8 months that tells me nothing positive about the future of this season or this team.  Why should I care when it seems that nobody else does?

Fire Q.  Sell some assets.  Stop the mediocrity.

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Somewhat vindicated
Amidst these terrible losses, I do feel somewhat vindicated in my staunch defenses of Brett Clark. The Avs got noticeably worse the moment he was hurt. Since that moment the Avs have been outscored 11-2 and lost all four games.

I would also take Duke and Clark off of your tradebait list. Hensick can stay on the no-trade list with his potential.

Never trust the lunch lady.

by Hardshell_Taco_del_Lowayne on Feb 19, 2008 8:02 AM MST reply actions  

You shouldn't.

Clark is awful defensively (worst on the team, by far), and so are the Avs in general. Having Clark out hasn't made a bit of difference, just like I said it wouldn't.

by Thomas @ Mile High Hockey on Feb 19, 2008 11:08 AM MST up reply actions  

except that they haven't won since he went down

granted, small sample size...but they've looked even worse since his injury, if that's possible.

at the end of the year, we can compare records and stats with and without Clark and see if there was any appreciable difference.  maybe that will tell us something?

by thedoctor on Feb 19, 2008 11:15 AM MST up reply actions  

No.

It won't.

The Avs' team defense improves slightly with him being out, but the offense from the point decreases as well. Plus, the Avs are going to be getting Sakic and Stastny back and hopefully getting rid of other players.

Judging a team's wins and losses based on the presence or absence of one skater is no better a metric of an individual player's value than +/- is. And we all know that +/- is completely useless and invalid in every instance in which it is applied to an individual player.

by Thomas @ Mile High Hockey on Feb 19, 2008 2:23 PM MST up reply actions  

then what?

Then what DO you judge by?

Some of the most technically sound players can be a bust. Many players find success even when they aren't the best at skating through cones or hurting people with body checks.

Helping teams win games seems like a good measuring stick, but I could be wrong.

As far as Clark goes - if you honestly think our D has improved with him out, I am done arguing. There is no point to it.

Never trust the lunch lady.

by Hardshell_Taco_del_Lowayne on Feb 19, 2008 2:47 PM MST up reply actions  

You're right.

There isn't a point in continuing arguing. If you think Clark plays even so much as average defense, then you don't know the first thing about defense.

by Thomas @ Mile High Hockey on Feb 19, 2008 3:23 PM MST up reply actions  

Hensick

Other than that brief stretch where he was scoring PP goals, he hasn't done much.  Actually, he has looked pretty awful.  He is almost making Wolski look like a hard worker out there.

Potential isn't going to get him anywhere if he doesn't think he needs to work in this league.  I say trade him while other teams also see his "potential."

by Bob in Boulder on Feb 19, 2008 11:37 AM MST up reply actions  

Re: Hensick

I think the odds are stacked against Hensick right now.  He's been dumped into a first line center role just one year out of college hockey.  He's got no real AHL experience.  He's good, but he's no Paul Stastny, and he shouldn't be expected to be.

Combined with the inept guidance of Coach Q and the lack of real leadership on the team, Hensick is a little lost puppy right now.

by Joe Dunman on Feb 19, 2008 12:54 PM MST up reply actions  

That of course

begs the question: How much better would SoS be if he hadn't had the detrimental aspects of 'Coach' Q for the last two seasons?  Maybe he wins the Calder outright with a coach that has some semblance of a clue...

by Mike @ MHH on Feb 19, 2008 2:17 PM MST up reply actions  

He's got...

...better potential than Stastny does. But his trade value is next-to-nothing, and he's been thrust into a situation he's not yet ready for.

We definitely need a leader and a coach. You're right that it's hurting him (not to mention Wolski, Jones, and the rest of the young guys).

by Thomas @ Mile High Hockey on Feb 19, 2008 2:24 PM MST up reply actions  

Re: He's got...

As far as the Stastny comment, I mean it in that Stastny was ready to play in the NHL right out of college.  Hensick isn't.  As for future star power, well, that's anybody's guess.  Since star players are built through more than just their own potential (the team around them is critical), the jury is still out on both Hensiiick and Stastny for now.

by Joe Dunman on Feb 19, 2008 2:34 PM MST up reply actions  

Well...

...Stastny is pretty much a star player now. He's definitely the type of guy you want on your team because he plays hard both ways.

Hensick never will be that guy. He's fast and has immense skill. He's a lot like Pavel Bure, only more of a playmaker than a goal scorer. Stastny is a lot like his pops, but if he doesn't develop any further, he'll be a Rod Brind'Amour type.

You're right though, environment makes a huge difference. So many guys we see as busts today would have been huge stars in a different situation, and vice-versa.

by Thomas @ Mile High Hockey on Feb 19, 2008 2:47 PM MST up reply actions  

Son of Stastny

Star player that he might be, he showed a ton of consistency in his rookie year and then a ton of inconsistency this season before his appendix betrayed him.  I'm a huge Stastny fan, but I'm wary of him, too.  He's still young and his career has just begun---I can't wait to see how he ends up in five or six more seasons.

As for your bust/star dichotomy, who immediately comes to mind?  I have a couple of ideas, but I'm interested in who I might have forgotten.

by Joe Dunman on Feb 19, 2008 2:59 PM MST up reply actions  

There are tons of examples.

Alex Daigle, for example. Picks #8-15 in the 2000 Draft. Pavel Brendl. Jeff Jillson.

One of my favorites is Christian Matte. In the right situation, he would have put up 70pts a year in the NHL, maybe more. But the Avs never gave him a shot on a scoring line.

Look at Radim Vrbata. Even as a second liner in Phoenix, he's leading his team in goals. He was the balls for us, then we dealt him and he did nothing in Carolina. He came on a bit last year in Chicago, then went to Phoenix and is lighting things up. Put him on the first line with some good linemates and the guy scores 40 goals.

The Avs have drafted a whole bunch of guys like that. Hejduk is like that, and you said so yourself. He's a complimentary player. He will produce really well if you put him with good players. He's the same as Vrbata and Matte. The only difference is the situation.

We've got a bunch of guys like that in our system right now. Brandon Yip, Mark McCutcheon, David Jones, Codey Burki, Denis Parshin, TJ Galiardi.

We let guys like Sean Collins, Frantisek Skladany and Brett Hemingway leave the system without being signed, and all of them could have been the same as Hejduk and Vrbata.

by Thomas @ Mile High Hockey on Feb 19, 2008 3:22 PM MST up reply actions  

i think...

you'll get your wish on the coaches...but not until years end.  Q's contract is up, I think they'll just let him walk.  Hopefully he'll go to a team in the NW and destroy their goalies too.  :)

the more interesting question to me will be how the organization treats the assistants.  Granato is a PL golden boy (how many coaching changes has he survived?) and I wonder if FG will have the balls to fire him too.  If he doesn't, you gotta wonder what it would take -- this PP is disgusting to watch.

by thedoctor on Feb 19, 2008 9:24 AM MST reply actions  

Re: I think

Maybe Giguere can trade Tony for Cammi.  I'd take her as a coach over him any day.  She had much better hockey sense during her playing days.

by Joe Dunman on Feb 19, 2008 9:29 AM MST up reply actions  

I agree

wholeheartedly.  I'd watch Avs games if it was Cammi screaming at opposing coaches.  For some reason, I bet her voice is lower than Tony's too...

by Mike @ MHH on Feb 19, 2008 12:00 PM MST up reply actions  

attn

refer to my comment in joe's thread above.

by Mike the Avs Fan on Feb 19, 2008 4:10 PM MST reply actions  

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