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Do the Avs need a fundamental shift in the way they play D?

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via www2.pictures.gi.zimbio.com

After last night's horrific collapse I started (actually continued) to wonder what the Avs problem was with holding on to leads. Even when they win games it seems like they often allow their opponents to creep back into the game; the Minnesota game on Monday being a good example. In the end I think that two stats can explain this; one 'good' and one bad: The Avs are 25th in the league in shots against per game with 32.2 and they are 2nd in the league in blocked shots with 640. Now clearly the 32.2 shots against is terrible but the 640 blocked shots should be a good thing right? Well let's look at the pros and cons of blocked shots.

Pros

-Stops the puck from reaching the net.

Only one pro but it's a big one. If the puck can't reach the net it isn't going to go in it.

Cons

-Can cause injuries. I know analysts are always praising players for sacrificing themselves but do any of us actually want to see Statsny go down for half a season blocking a shot?

-Can deflect the puck on net or screen the goalie if the block fails.

-To block a shot, a shot needs to be fired which means that the OTHER team is in control of the puck.

These cons mean that a blocked shot should be the method of last resort. They are dangerous, easy to screw up and a player is reacting instead of taking the initiative. So the fact that the Avs have 640 blocked shots is actually not an enviable statistic.

All year we've had to watch the Avs sit back on a lead and they often lose it. My first response is to rail about the laziness and timidness of the players. But really? Do Duchene, O'Reilly or Hejduk seem like the type to stop skating? Do Galiardi, McLeod or Stewart seem like the type to stop playing with an edge to their game unless explicitly instructed to by their coach?

I am starting to think that this method of defense is one designed and pursued by the coaching staff. Optimally they want the Avs to play positional D where they keep the opposing players to the outside and block as many shots as possible. It doesn't sound bad but it is not working. The Avs are probably allowing more shots than any other team in the league right now and Anderson seems to be wearing out.

I think that the Avs need to play the exact opposite. Constantly pressure the puck whether they are down by 2 or up by 4. They are at their best when they are playing a hard forecheking game and their takeaway numbers (316, 4th in the league) are really good. The Avs need to take the initiative and play a puck control game rather than wait for the puck to come to them and try and get in front of it.

What do you think?

MileHighHockey.com is a fan community, allowing members to post their own thoughts and opinions on the Colorado Avalanche and hockey in general. These views and thoughts may not be shared by the editors of MileHighHockey.com.

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I agree. I always have thought they should never stop playing a hard forecheck-style of game, no matter what the score. Hell, if they are up 8-0, they should still be in the offensive zone as much as they can. Let others tell them their douches for running up the score. Whatever. It’s better than sitting on a lead, hoping it will last.

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 23, 2009 12:31 PM MST reply actions  

That’s just it. The team seems unable to spend time in the offensive zone. The vast majority of the time we are being significantly outshot. This certainly makes it harder to win.

Sandie

"That’s the way we’ll win championships"- The Baron

by sandiegee on Dec 23, 2009 12:37 PM MST up reply actions  

I fully agree. We’re a great forechecking team, so why not play that way for 60 minutes? However, take a look at the shots per period from last night. We were out shot by more than double in every period. It’s not just our “prevent defense” that’s killing us, but our defense from puck drop to the final whistle.

by Toast88 on Dec 23, 2009 12:39 PM MST reply actions  

and when you look at this, i just don’t see how people put so much blame on the defense for these losses. isn’t it the offense’s job to cycle the puck around the net? i realize the d needs to keep it in at the blue line, but the offense has some serious culpability with how much time is spent in the defensive vs. the offensive zone and the number of shots put on the opponent’s net.

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 23, 2009 12:58 PM MST up reply actions  

The Avalanche offense, both last year and this, struggles to keep the puck in the opposing zone. They also struggle to shoot. They don’t seem to have much of an offensive presence, despite their periodic success.

Mile High Hockey: Hoping for the best, expecting the worst, hating the Wings.

by Joe Dunman on Dec 23, 2009 2:31 PM MST up reply actions  

Our biggest problem from last year and this year is the fact that we can’t keep the puck in the opposing zone but we can’t seem to clear it from our zone either. It’s an entire team mentality, not just the defense

by Toast88 on Dec 23, 2009 3:08 PM MST up reply actions  

This.

Sandie

"That’s the way we’ll win championships"- The Baron

by sandiegee on Dec 23, 2009 3:25 PM MST up reply actions  

Exactly. 3 guesses where we rank in S/G? That’s right, 30th with 25.8.

by Toast88 on Dec 23, 2009 1:08 PM MST reply actions  

That’s just depressing. Imagine how many goals we’d have if we were SHOOTING THE FREAKING THING

Bills fan? In Colorado? It's more likely than you think.

by UZ on Dec 23, 2009 2:03 PM MST up reply actions  

Who is #1?

Last night at the game, they showed the stat that the AVS were 2nd in the league last year in blocked shots. Who was #1 you ask? Why it was the mighty NY Islanders, who finished dead last in the ENTIRE league. So the two best shot blocking teams, were also the two who finished bottom in their respective conferences.
Hmm….maybe the AVS should focus on defense and not leaving people open around the net, rather than being good at getting hits by things.

by Paul's Coffey on Dec 23, 2009 3:51 PM MST reply actions  

Guess who came fourth last year in blocked shots?

Pittsburgh. They also led all teams in blocked shots in the playoff, and by a wide margin; they had almost 200 more than Detroit, the next closest team.

by ExiledAmongYou on Dec 23, 2009 6:11 PM MST up reply actions  

Goddamn statistics.

Mile High Hockey: Hoping for the best, expecting the worst, hating the Wings.

by Joe Dunman on Dec 23, 2009 7:42 PM MST up reply actions  

Last night's game was an absolute nightmare!

It was the first time in a long time that I was embarrassed to be an Avs fan.

There are three big things that are on my mind right now.

First, this team needs to figure out a way to get the puck out of the offensive zone! This team’s inability to get the puck out of the zone is a small problem that is causing several other problems. The first of those being the excessive amount of shots that are making it on net. 32.2 shots per game is too many. Yes, the team has blocked 640 shots through 40 games which is good, but the fact that they are having to block that many is unacceptable. I found it rather comical that McNabb said during the broadcast that the Avs have been limiting the number of shots that teams have been taking over the past few games. What team has he been watching?? They gave up 25 shots against the Caps, 31 shots against the Wild, 30 against the lowly Blue Jackets and then there is last night’s 43 shot explosion by the Ducks.

Second, the fact of the matter is, Craig Anderson is human. Most nights he plays God like because the team in front of him forces him to. My gut tells me that Coach Sacco came to him prior to last nights game and asked him if he was good to go. He said “yes” because that is. Being the competitor that he is, he is going to try and start as many games as the coach will allow him to. That is his net. He just lets Budes borrow it every now and then.

Third, I just went over all of the games that the Avs have played so far this season and they have given up 35 or more shots NINE TIMES! 40 or more shots FIVE TIMES! Most embarassing of all is the 49 shots they gave up against the Red Wings back in October, luckily Anderson somehow managed to stop 48 of them for the win.

If the Avs keep playing like this, the second half of this season is going to look very similar to last season. The sad thing? The are only going to have themselves to blame.

MHH: A Colorado Avalanche Fan Community
Defending Big D: A Dallas Stars blog on SBN: easy to use, free to join.

by Derek B on Dec 23, 2009 3:57 PM MST reply actions   1 recs

Well Said

Every game when they get a lead you just know the other team is going to tie it up in time. It’s sad. There’s no killer instinct. The only way ever to win is to attack, attack, and then attack some more.

by candide on Dec 25, 2009 9:44 AM MST up reply actions  

The problem with the Avs’ D, in my opinion, is not it’s style. Keeping teams to the outside and blocking shots can be an effective strategy. Where the Avs run into trouble is when assignments are missed or other mental errors happen that have nothing to do with the defensive strategy.

Let’s look at the 3 goals from last night (excluding the EN goal):

1st goal: The 3 Av forwards allow the 3 Duck forwards, plus Niedermayer, to get behind them in the neutral zone. This creates a 4 on 2 in the Avs’ zone, leading to Niedermayer (whom nobody picks up, by the way; Stastny should have come back deeper and picked up Niedermayer) putting the puck in the empty net. Nothing to do with the keep-it-to-the-outside strategy, everything to do with poor neutral and defensive zone coverage from the forwards.

2nd goal: Good coverage by Duchene on Koivu, but a good move by Koivu allows him to centre it. No problem, both Wilson and Foote are in front of the net. But Foote allows his guy to drive right by him to the net, and Wilson takes his eyes off of his guy (Sexton) for just an instant, allowing Sexton to get position on him. If both Foote and Wilson have position on their guys and have their sticks tied up like they should, Koivu’s centreing pass (barring an unlucky bounce) can be harmlessly cleared away. Again, poor defensive coverage led to the goal, not the Avs’ strategy.

3rd goal: Avs lose a puck battle down low, Stastny loses his man (Perry) as Getzlaf drives to the net without being picked up by Quincey. As a result, Perry is free to pass off to the open guy in front, who then puts it upstairs on Anderson.

Yes, the Avs need to get some more offense going, and get some more shots on net. But their main problem last night (from what I saw from the highlights and last 10 minutes of the third, at least) was breakdowns in the defensive zone and not taking advantage of the chances they did get (particularly on odd man rushes).

by ExiledAmongYou on Dec 23, 2009 6:33 PM MST reply actions  

Do we not have any cap room to pick up a D-man that can play fundamentally? It seems as if almost, not all, but almost every goal we manage to put into the net seems as a sloppy happenstance goal. Dump, chase, blind centering pass, and a half ass lucky chop infront of the goal is all that puts them in. I know I’ll catch flak for saying that, but it frustrates me. The Av’s look like frantic little kids.
LOOK! The puck! Go get it!

A vasectomy means never having to say you're sorry.
-- Anonymous

by Av O.C.D. on Dec 23, 2009 11:46 PM MST via mobile reply actions  

Props to Dustin

AD cited your post in his blog today and was discussing it.

http://blogs.denverpost.com/avs/2009/12/24/some-other-viewpoints-on-the-avs/#disqus_thread

Excellent Work!

Colorado Avalanche: Please excuse the mess while we are under construction.

by hockeymom on Dec 24, 2009 12:04 PM MST reply actions  

Saw that too. Guess that means he reads MHH.

Sandie

"That’s the way we’ll win championships"- The Baron

by sandiegee on Dec 24, 2009 12:12 PM MST up reply actions  

he does. mirtle stops by too. i actually think MHH has a pretty good rep, skrastins notwithstanding

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 24, 2009 12:26 PM MST up reply actions  

Nice!!

Props to Dustin, Jibbles and Jori!!
Me thinks AD is having an easier time writing his blog with all this great content from this community!!

"You mess with our Hejduk and the Spirit of Lappy is coming!"-Jibbles
MHH- The Haiku capital of AvsNation.

by gl avfan on Dec 24, 2009 12:13 PM MST up reply actions  

lol. think he’s stealing stuff?

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 24, 2009 12:27 PM MST up reply actions  

Not “stealing”, borrowing!

Sandie

"That’s the way we’ll win championships"- The Baron

by sandiegee on Dec 24, 2009 12:34 PM MST up reply actions  

Ideas freely shared on the interwebs canot be intellectual property. Can they? If so, I’m screwed, I haven’t had an original thought in years!!

"You mess with our Hejduk and the Spirit of Lappy is coming!"-Jibbles
MHH- The Haiku capital of AvsNation.

by gl avfan on Dec 24, 2009 1:13 PM MST up reply actions  

I don’t think there’s been an original thought on this planet since 1994.

Bills fan? In Colorado? It's more likely than you think.

by UZ on Dec 25, 2009 6:00 PM MST up reply actions  

AD

He’s said that he’s going to start linking to blogs more often than he used to. He says we (Avs bloggers) do a pretty good job, and generating interest in the team helps him too. Also we link to him fairly often, so he kinda returns the favor.

The New Improved Avalanche. Now with Real Coaches!
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time

by Jibblescribbits on Dec 26, 2009 10:15 AM MST up reply actions  

Nice!

And we were just giving him a hard time! He does a great job and often has something to add that we hadn’t heard already.

"You mess with our Hejduk and the Spirit of Lappy is coming!"-Jibbles
MHH- The Haiku capital of AvsNation.

by gl avfan on Dec 26, 2009 11:12 AM MST up reply actions  

He does do a good job

I just really wish two things, and they both relate to his newly added videos which, for the record, I do like:

(1) he turns up the volume if he can; for whatever reason, I cannot hear the interviews. I hear the videos on every other site just fine. His are just too low for most of them and I simply turn them off.
(2) he improves his interviewing techniques. If he’s going to video format, he has got to learn how to interview. It’s painful to listen to so, when I can hear them, I often cringe through his questioning. The player starts answering his question, but Dater continues on talking, often to the point of babbling. Sometimes I can even see a bit of annoyance on the players’ faces. Or maybe that’s just what I’m reading cuz I’m annoyed. I actually mentioned to him he might look into improving his on-air interviewing techniques and he cut me down with a “you might as well ask me to change my personality” defensive comment. As both a former actress and a current teacher, I can confidently say, personality has nothing to do with technique. He obviously doesn’t see it that way as he hasn’t changed anything and I doubt he will. It’s a shame too because, like you said, he often has something to add that we haven’t already heard.
/steps down from soapbox yet again.

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 26, 2009 2:06 PM MST up reply actions  

It’s been days, and this loss is still grinding me.

If Santa comes down my chimney wearing those Red Wing colors, he's going to wish he didn't exist.

by Dixomatic on Dec 24, 2009 12:21 PM MST reply actions  

pour a hefty shot of brandy in some egg nog and focus on saturday! = )

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 24, 2009 12:27 PM MST up reply actions  

I’m really looking forward to Dec 31st, am I the only one? Canada vs USA in the World Junior Finals!

Sandie

"That’s the way we’ll win championships"- The Baron

by sandiegee on Dec 24, 2009 12:34 PM MST up reply actions  

Umm….. Avs-Wings?

Forever grateful that Joe Sakic isn't a douche bag like Brett Favre.

by Rather Dashing on Dec 24, 2009 2:03 PM MST up reply actions  

There’s that too. ;-)

"You mess with our Hejduk and the Spirit of Lappy is coming!"-Jibbles
MHH- The Haiku capital of AvsNation.

by gl avfan on Dec 24, 2009 2:10 PM MST up reply actions  

Sorry, that goes without saying!

Sandie

"That’s the way we’ll win championships"- The Baron

by sandiegee on Dec 24, 2009 2:48 PM MST up reply actions  

Mmmmmm

The other night I discovered French Vanilla Kahlua in Egg Nog. I highly recommend it!!

"You mess with our Hejduk and the Spirit of Lappy is coming!"-Jibbles
MHH- The Haiku capital of AvsNation.

by gl avfan on Dec 24, 2009 1:14 PM MST up reply actions  

OOOHHH

Shopping trip!

Sandie

"That’s the way we’ll win championships"- The Baron

by sandiegee on Dec 24, 2009 1:54 PM MST up reply actions  

Yeah!!

It’s a good thing for the size of my ass that Egg Nog isn’t available all year ( and that I’m way too lazy to make my own !)

"You mess with our Hejduk and the Spirit of Lappy is coming!"-Jibbles
MHH- The Haiku capital of AvsNation.

by gl avfan on Dec 24, 2009 1:57 PM MST up reply actions  

i like your ass.

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 25, 2009 11:20 AM MST up reply actions  

LOL!!

Thanks!! At least someone does!! ;)

"You mess with our Hejduk and the Spirit of Lappy is coming!"-Jibbles
MHH- The Haiku capital of AvsNation.

by gl avfan on Dec 25, 2009 11:57 AM MST up reply actions  

I suspect I am not the only one, sweets!

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 25, 2009 3:57 PM MST up reply actions  

AVS Scoring

There are two arguments to follow:

1. Get a lead and hold it with good defense.
2. Get a lead and pile on with an attacking offense.

Both options have won Stanley Cups in the past. The default NHL answer is #1, however.

If the AVS adopted #2, there outcomes might be even better than they currently are. As of 23 December games, they are #5 in the 1st period with 36 goals scored and #2 in the second with 47 goals scored. They drop to #27 in the 3rd period with only 29 goals scored as you alluded to in the original blog by sitting back in defensive mode.

Assuming an attacking offense would land with total goals scored in the 3rd period somewhere between the 1st and 2nd period totals, they should be scoring about 42 goals in the 3rd. The additional 13 goals would have potentially taken care of some of those eight, one-goal losses suffered and put them even higher in the standings than they are.

LTC Mike Pryor
Managing Director
OGA Enterprises, LLC

by Pelican 4 on Dec 26, 2009 10:47 AM MST reply actions  

And though I do not have all the numbers to back it up, I can without a doubt say this: the Avs have not had one single blow out win this entire season despite taking a couple of spankings of their own. It’s time to go with argument #2, be a bunch of cocky bastards and get a 10-2 win.

"They're unbelievable, really good...They sure don't look like 18-year-olds out there." - Joe Sakic

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 26, 2009 2:10 PM MST up reply actions  

It’s time to go with argument #2, be a bunch of cocky bastards and get a 10-2 win.

Hmmm, looking at my schedule, I believe that this coming Thursday, December 31st, is free. Shall we pencil it in?

2009-2010 Colorado Avalanche - Time to grow a pair, boys!

by Hopfenkopf on Dec 27, 2009 6:53 PM MST up reply actions  

THIS
THIS
THIS
THIS
THIS
THIS
THIS
THIS

and
TTTTTTTTTTTTTTTHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Beachie: Headed on a humanitarian quest to Ibiza in order to help twenty-something Spanish men recover from groin injuries.

by BeachNSnowGirl on Dec 28, 2009 11:44 AM MST up reply actions  

I know I’m late to the party, but I have been advocating this for a year. Thanks for putting it into a clear and concise argument.

Thanks Joe...

by mfured20 on Dec 28, 2009 3:31 PM MST reply actions  

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