Daniel Winnik and the Coach of Doom.
by An Unmitigated Disaster on Nov 29, 2011 11:18 AM MST
Email
Print
First off let me say I'm never going to do this again, but I'd noticed that Winnik has been leading the forwards in TOI for quite a while, then Mike asked me how much of that was even strength. The short answer to that was, I didn't know, if it was built up by all his work on the PK then I was harping on the wrong thing. So let's find out if I'm wrong together eh?
If you take anything away from this it shoudln't be that I'm an anti-winnik-ite, I'm pretty much in the fire Sacco camp.
I went to NHL.com here: http://www.nhl.com/ice/gamestats.htm?season=20112012&gameType=2&team=COL&viewName=teamRTSSreports#?navid=nav-sts-gbyg
it's the game by game shift charts in case anyone wants them.
That's a pile of stats that I didn't want to wade through so being lazy I went here and they gave me what I need: http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.htm?season=20112012&gameType=2&team=COL&position=F&country=&status=&viewName=timeOnIce
Because I'm not all that great at formatting or graphs, I'll let you all click on the link and just give my .2¢, it will save on the typing and I am getting paid to design offices, not talk hockey (as far as anyone knows).
So, what I take away from that is that winnik has been on the ice about 9 minutes more than any other forward on the avs. I'm not really sure you want a guy who is as offensively limited to be playing that many minutes. While he could be getting all the defensive zone starts that's not likely. Then you have Stastny, O'Reilly, Hedjuk and Landeskog bunched up, then Duchene below them then Jones, then the rest.
A cursory glance shows that the total PK and PP minutes played by Winnik could be evened out by his more talented peers PP minutes and his average on the PK is close to the averages of Duchene, Hedjuk and Stastny on the PP and if you add their total minutes of special teams times, they're close, so I'll move onto the ES minutes:
Hi Winnik, you're leading the team in average and total time on ice, even strenght. I am somewhat surprised that Duchene, who is leading the team with Points and goals isn't getting more ice time and that the #6 (Factor) and #11(Winnik) scorers are #1 and #2 at even strength, you know since he has one more ES goal than both of those guys.
It gets worse if you look at behind the net's numbers (I don't know why those differ from NHL.com's):
there they have Landeskog and O'Reilly getting more ES toi than Stastny, Duchene, Jones and Hedjuk.
I didn't have all morning to find a site that had the avs minutes in november, if someone can let me know of one I'll update it. What I do have is this:
Winnik: http://www.forecaster.ca/thestar.com/hockey/player-gbg.cgi?4856
he's playing about 18-21 minutes a game over the last 15 games or so.
Stastny: http://www.forecaster.ca/thestar.com/hockey/player-gbg.cgi?4812
It varies but in the same time, he's playing 16-20 minutes total, but it's tailed off a lot lately.
Duchene: http://www.forecaster.ca/thestar.com/hockey/player-gbg.cgi?7276
Pretty consistantly between 16-19 minutes or so per game in the same time.
O'Reilly:http://www.forecaster.ca/thestar.com/hockey/player-gbg.cgi?7452
pretty consistanly between 18-20 minutes.
What I draw from that is:
When Duchene plays less than 19 minutes a game he doesn't score. Over that he's pretty dyanmic. Stastny is pretty ineffective when he's in the doghouse, he doesn't score without some minutes. Winnik, has been getting really consistant 1st line minutes. Jones has fallen off the map. I think that Sacco values hard work quite a bit and he obviously trusts Winnik probably more than any other player on the team, other than O'Reilly, and they are taking quite a few shots between them that aren't going in. Either they're unlucky or it's a poor use of resources. In the NHL you live and die by your stars (Hello Bruce Boudreau and Paul Maurice) and if you can't get them to produce, like Sacco isn't, you're not going to be employed for long.
MileHighHockey.com is a fan community, allowing members to post their own thoughts and opinions on the Colorado Avalanche and hockey in general. These views and thoughts may not be shared by the editors of MileHighHockey.com.
24 comments
|
4 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Nice work.
But I don’t need to see the statistics to know Sacco is giving Winnik too much TOI. I don’t care if your best players aren’t playing their best hockey, I want the top two lines on the ice the most. These are the guys you depend on to score goals, not #34. Winnik should be playing ~15 min a game on the third line and PK, no more.
Duchene, Stasnty, and Hejduk are our best forwards. That line should be cemented every game and be leading us in TOI
"Put stick on ice, put puck in net"
by HeyPeterman on Nov 29, 2011 12:59 PM MST via mobile reply actions
Felicitations on the symbolism contained in the recent modification of your avatar.
2011-2012 Lokomotiv Yaroslavl: Vyechnaya Pamyat!
2011-2012 Colorado Avalanche: Chances are rapidly diminishing that this will not suck.
I protest where I can.
Spoon!!!!!!!!
by An Unmitigated Disaster on Nov 29, 2011 2:57 PM MST up reply actions 2 recs
good work
Maybe
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on Nov 29, 2011 2:35 PM MST reply actions
Can we mail this to everyone in the management end of the organization?
At exactly what point do you start to realize that life without knowledge is death in disguise?
Can you put it in suppository form so it will reach their eyeballs?
"In my experience, there's no such thing as luck" -Obi Wan Kenobi
I don't understand the purpose of the line, "I don't need to drink
to have fun." Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and
sticks when they've invented the lighter?
Sacco,
Maybe
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on Nov 30, 2011 7:04 AM MST up reply actions 3 recs
This made me laugh.
When does the hurting stop?
by BraxtanFILM on Nov 30, 2011 11:54 AM MST up reply actions
Sandiee is one and I’m guessing the other two are hipsters trying to be ironic.
Spoon!!!!!!!!
by An Unmitigated Disaster on Nov 30, 2011 9:23 AM MST up reply actions
BTW, I love your new avatar. Perfectly sums things up.
When does the hurting stop?
by BraxtanFILM on Nov 30, 2011 11:54 AM MST up reply actions
Ditto
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
by Hardshell_Taco_del_Lowayne on Nov 30, 2011 12:14 PM MST up reply actions
Actually, I hadn’t voted.
I can see both sides. Part of me thinks he is getting the right numbers because he is playing as, almost, a third defenseman. The Avs, last game withstanding, are having a Hell of a time scoring goals. If you can’t get the likes of Duchene, SoS and Duke to score, even while being on huge beefed up lines, you have to try and minimize the amount of goals that the other team is going to be able to score. I think, and I’m well aware that I hold them in high regards, that Winnik and Radar give the team an advantage in that area.
He isn’t your typical third-liner. Third liners are usually much grittier, and Winnik is certainly not that. That being said, if SoS, Duke and Duchene had more time perhaps they’d mesh better and score more. So I guess I feel that he isn’t playing too much, but that the top line isn’t playing enough?
It's all about Winnik
by Sandie Gauthier on Dec 2, 2011 3:52 PM MST up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Mile High Hockey
Related FanShots on Mile High Hockey
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
