Final Grade: Matt Duchene
by David Driscoll-Carignan on May 11, 2011 7:00 AM MDT
in Final Grades 2011
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This report card is a joint effort by Beachie, Sandie, Paul, SlamDunktheFunk and DDC. Stats courtesy of hockey-reference.com and NHL.com
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Final Grade |
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Final Grade: A-
Midseason Grade: A+
Last Year: A-
Position: C (77gp), LW (3gp)
(36gp 1st line, 44gp 2nd line)
Vitals: 5'9" 5'11" / 200 / Age 20 / Shoots Left
Drafted by Colorado, 3rd overall in 2009
Joined Avalanche: Made the team out of training camp 2009. Made his NHL debut in the season opener on Oct. 1 vs. San Jose, recording an assist.
MHH Nicknames: Dutchy, Absolut Duchene, Boy Wonder, Mighty Matt
Linemates:
LW:
- Fleischmann 21gp 11g 10a 21pt -1
- Jones 17gp 5g 8a 13pt +2
- Olver 11gp 5g 9a 14pt -1
- Porter 10gp 3g 5a 8pt +1
- Yip 8gp 0g 4a 4pt -1
- Forsberg 2gp 1g 0a 1pt -4
- Stewart 2gp 0g 0a 0pt -1
- Stoa 2gp 1g 0a 1pt -1
- McClement 1gp 0g 1a 1pt -3
- McLeod 1gp 0g 1a 1pt +1
- O'Reilly 1gp 0g 0a 0pt +1
- Galiardi 1gp 0g 0a 0pt -2
C:
- Stastny 3gp 1g 2a 3pt +1
RW:
- Hejduk 52gp 12g 29a 41pt -7
- Jones 12gp 7g 5a -3
- Winnik 9gp 5g 5a 10pt +3
- Stewart 4gp 2g 0a 2pt +1
- Fleischmann 1gp 0g 0a 0pt -2
- Mauldin 1gp 1g 0a 0pt Even
- Yip 1gp 0g 1a 1pt Even
Most Common Line:
- Jones - Duchene - Hejduk (14gp 3g 7a 10pt Even)
Avs with Duchene in the lineup: 30-43-7 (.419 pt%) 2.8 GF 3.5 GA
Ice Time:
- TTOI 18:56 (2nd)
- ES 16:01 (1st)
- PP 2:50 (3rd)
- PK 0:04 (14th)
Career Highlights: Duchene was the youngest player in franchise history to lead the team in scoring and reach 100 career points. In his first appearance at the NHL All-Star Game, he became the youngest player in Avalanche history to participate and the first player in NHL history to be awarded a penalty shot. He had his first career fighting major on Nov. 15, 2010, vs. Vladimir Sobotka of the St. Louis Blues, and had a career-high six-game point streak (5g/4a) from March 12-24, 2011. He led the team in points (67) and shots (202), in addition to tying for first in goals (27) and games played (80).
Report: Some people felt disappointment with Duchene's performance as he had a big slump in the middle of the year. He did have a tendency to try for the pretty plays, dangling and maneuvering his way out of puck possession. His defensive play - which started out impressively improved over 2009-2010 - began looking suspect. And he simply could not hit the twine. However, his collective contributions over the entire season were anything but disappointing. There were few games when he wasn't the best player on the ice, and he showed that he is already tapping into that elite player potential. You only need to look at the competition he faced - the top forward lines and defensive pairings - to see that.
His biggest struggles came about because his wingers kept dropping like flies. At some point, he had to feel he was cursed (or the curse). Last year's heady feeling created by the idea of the Mueller-Duchene-Hejduk line quickly evaporated with Ferris' 1,365th concussion pre-season. The skies parted and hope prevailed with the addition of Tomas Fleischman, as their chemistry was a thing of beauty. In true Avalanche fashion, though, Flash went down with a season-ending injury, once again forcing Duchene to adjust to yet another LWer. After much juggling, Dutchy found Mark Olver complimenting his style well, and he was able to close out the season being that mesmerizing player we know and love. Far from a sophomore slump, Duchene's follow-up campaign to a stellar rookie season saw improvements in nearly all areas, including goals, points, face-offs, shots, and penalty minutes. He also stepped up as a leader, both on and off the ice, and continued his tradition of pushing himself to improve his play.
Fun Fact: Duchene started a Twitter account this year in order to help the fans feel like they are part of what's going on with the team and see a side of him that they wouldn't in game-related interviews. Recently, he Tweeted that he uses a curve on his stick invented by Joey Hishon and that he's soon going to record a song with singer and songwriter, Guinevere.
The Matt Duchene Drinking Game involves vodka Drunk Potential: Depends on the legal drinking age in your country
What We Said Last Year: Through the middle of the season he was absolutely brilliant, scoring most of his 24 goals and showing he could be dominant. Unfortunately, he also went through two streaks where he couldn't score a goal to save his life. Duchene has the ability and the intelligence to become a Datsyuk-like dominant center in this league.
2010 Cap Hit: $3,200,000
2011 Status: Signed through next summer, RFA at expiry.
Outlook for Next Season: Duchene is set to solidify his place as the top line center for the Avs. As one of only two players receiving an "A"-level grade from the ace evaluators here at the M Double H Ranch, the Avalanche need him to continue to develop...and hope that some of the other young talent around him can make jumps to the next level
Next Up: Kyle Cumiskey
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Comments
Dutchy held without a point in another Worlds game. I really wish he had a better performance.
It’s nice to see Holos doing so well for Norway, though. I’d like to see him stick on that third pairing next season.
Quincy and Big Johnson on a line
Liles and (maybe one of the young guns Elliot maybe)
Wilson and Holos
FUck the red wings, indeed.
isn’t he playing on teh 3rd line?
Each of my replies is a work of art, each more brilliant than the last.
by An Unmitigated Disaster on May 11, 2011 9:10 AM MDT up reply actions
O'byrne?
No O’Byrne? I’d like to see O’Byrne over Wilson to be honest. But I really want the Avs to go out and sign a decent defenseman to compliment Liles (I like Ian White. Not sure why he gets traded so much, but he’s a good player from everything I’ve seen)
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 9:52 AM MDT up reply actions
Look at the next post down. You of all people should be able to locate Jibbles! :)
And agreed. OB needs to stay with Liles for a while. At least until we bring in someone better.
Just a Colorado girl in Montana who <3s the Avs.
My bad
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 10:00 AM MDT up reply actions
I’d like to see his shot total up around 250 next year.
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
I’m just hoping we have a Duchene Wing for him at all times of next season. MorF would be my first choice, but geez, even if we had to go with Olver, I just want Dutch to have someone he has chemistry with on his left wing for 82 games. I think that would help Dutch more than anything else.
Duchene <3
Just a Colorado girl in Montana who <3s the Avs.
I’m not sure about the power part….well they are powerful when healthy.
M(ueller) or (F)leischman = M or F = MorF
Datsyuk may have done it first, but he learned it from Peter Forsberg.
Thanks for everything Foppa!
Footer: We'll miss seeing you clear the riff raff off your lawn.
by Americanario on May 11, 2011 12:08 PM MDT up reply actions
Is the yellow one Johnson?
Datsyuk may have done it first, but he learned it from Peter Forsberg.
Thanks for everything Foppa!
Footer: We'll miss seeing you clear the riff raff off your lawn.
by Americanario on May 11, 2011 8:54 PM MDT up reply actions
I like his drinking game…and I am legal in all countries I believe
Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?
Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson
I still love that name.
Thank you, Footer. You - and your nose - will never be forgotten.
Avalanche Breakaway: a blog of hockey goodness
You just like the Magnus part.
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
my favorite part is the hyphen
I am the most humble blogger of all time
by David Driscoll-Carignan on May 11, 2011 8:42 AM MDT up reply actions
Magnus always makes me think of those crazy strongmen competitions on ESPN
Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?
The hyphen makes me think of people I hate.
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
feeling love
I am the most humble blogger of all time
by David Driscoll-Carignan on May 11, 2011 8:59 AM MDT up reply actions
My throws/strength coach from college competed in that competition one year. Then the year it was in Prim (Nevada/California Boarder) he took us down to meet some of the guys and see it live.
Datsyuk may have done it first, but he learned it from Peter Forsberg.
Thanks for everything Foppa!
Footer: We'll miss seeing you clear the riff raff off your lawn.
by Americanario on May 11, 2011 12:12 PM MDT up reply actions
I agree, someone on the avs should get Pierre-Luc Letourneau-Leblond. Sure, he’s not good but I’d rock that jersey.
Each of my replies is a work of art, each more brilliant than the last.
by An Unmitigated Disaster on May 11, 2011 9:13 AM MDT up reply actions
I wonder if RNH will eventually drop the hyphen.
Ryan Hopkins – This sounds better to me.
Ryan Nugent
Ryan Nugent-Hopkisn-Driscoll-Carignan
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
Bust.
Each of my replies is a work of art, each more brilliant than the last.
by An Unmitigated Disaster on May 11, 2011 9:13 AM MDT up reply actions
Yes, yes we will.
"It's all about the $"
by Busted Twigg on May 11, 2011 10:13 AM MDT up reply actions
I sure hope we’ll be able to look back at this years draft, in a couple years, and state that we would take the same guy, if we could do it over again. Whoever that may be, even Landeskog ;) Seriously though, if they take Landeskog, I’m sure it’s because he’s the BPA, with the highest ceiling. But until they do, I have a hard time believing it.
If I could go back
I’d take the best player available, of course. Means correct answer is Victor Hedman.
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
Does this assume that Duchene was grabbed by the Islanders with the first overall?
"It's all about the $"
by Busted Twigg on May 11, 2011 9:11 AM MDT up reply actions
No.
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
by A.J. Haefele on May 11, 2011 9:12 AM MDT up reply actions
I wonder if Duchene can hit 40 or 50 next year?
Each of my replies is a work of art, each more brilliant than the last.
by An Unmitigated Disaster on May 11, 2011 9:15 AM MDT reply actions
Duchene is still on the upswing. The “average” superstar peaks somewhere between his 4th and 6th season. I make this claim based on some number crunching I did after the first Kovalchuk contract came out. I used the top-20 scorers in NHL history to do the computations
All the goofiness out at the far right is due to Gordie Howe. His best season in his 23rd year shows he was some kind of alien.
"It's all about the $"
by Busted Twigg on May 11, 2011 9:30 AM MDT up reply actions
I expect Duchene’s peak will be more like his 6-7 year instead of 4-5 like the graph shows. His first NHL season was earlier than most…
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 9:40 AM MDT up reply actions
I agree. His physical development is a couple years behind the average.
"It's all about the $"
by Busted Twigg on May 11, 2011 9:42 AM MDT up reply actions
What the hell is with that 23 year bump? Or is that just Mark Recchi and Selanne.
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
Gordie Howe and small sample size
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 9:51 AM MDT up reply actions
Gordie Howe had over 100 points in his 23rd season. Again, Mr. Hockey is an alien.
"It's all about the $"
by Busted Twigg on May 11, 2011 10:08 AM MDT up reply actions
HOW DARE YOU KADRI IS A GOD I WOULDN’T TRADE HIM FOR STASTNY YOU SHOULD TRADE STASTNY FOR BOZAK + PHI 1ST
/hf
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
I am confused
Why you ever insult Kadri by putting him in the same sentence as Stastny.
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
I completely disagree with an A-. Duchene was abysmal for 2 months. Not just a big slump, but for over 1/4 of the season he was downright awful. I don’t worry about the future with him, and I don’t think he’s the SUXOR or anything like that. But in regards to this season alone he was downright F to D quality for 2 months and I think people have glossed over that fact because we like him and anticipate very good things from him.
I’d write more, but I’m going to write on this site on the internet that exists for me to share my thoughts on. Who knew?
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 9:39 AM MDT reply actions
you have like a blog or something?
I am the most humble blogger of all time
by David Driscoll-Carignan on May 11, 2011 9:53 AM MDT up reply actions
Something like that
It’s got fancy graphics and everything!
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 9:53 AM MDT up reply actions
congrats. hope it works out for you
I am the most humble blogger of all time
by David Driscoll-Carignan on May 11, 2011 9:57 AM MDT up reply actions
It’s called “In the Cheap Seats”
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 10:01 AM MDT up reply actions
that’s a stupid name.
I am the most humble blogger of all time
by David Driscoll-Carignan on May 11, 2011 10:16 AM MDT up reply actions
I heard the guy that used to own that site sold out to the man.
We see a wonderful sun-soaked city nestled at the foot of the Rocky Mountains. Enos sees nickels and dimes.
by Bob in Boulder on May 11, 2011 10:28 AM MDT up reply actions
He used to dodge drafts too.
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
He also came out of the closet a few months ago….as a redwing fan
Datsyuk may have done it first, but he learned it from Peter Forsberg.
Thanks for everything Foppa!
Footer: We'll miss seeing you clear the riff raff off your lawn.
by Americanario on May 11, 2011 12:40 PM MDT up reply actions
That’s grades of “F” or “D” not "Forward"or “Defenseman”.
Just clarifying for Doc. ;)
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 9:53 AM MDT up reply actions
im never living that one down, am i
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Sure
If you do it 100 times We’ll start calling it a doc or something, but I figure I’ve got 2 weeks of razzing you before the joke expires.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 10:06 AM MDT up reply actions
Have to agree
Duchene did play abysmal for two months. Yes, there were chemistry issues as it was musical chairs at LW. But, Duchene became hesitant with shooting the puck. Hopefully he puts this into perspective and if the injuries continue next year, he takes a more active role by shooting the damn puck.
Final Grade B-/C+
I liken the "depth" of Avalanche centers to a carton of eggs; good for you if cooked properly. Unfortunately I liken the Western Conference to a butter laden frying pan.
I like the grade. I expect slumps for a 2nd year player, and yet he still led the team in scoring. that’s gotta be an A imo.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
10 games is a slump, 22 games is atrocious. And leading this team in scoring isn’t exactly a challenge.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 10:02 AM MDT up reply actions
I look at it this way. Most of the wings he had were nearly point per game players on his wing, or at the very worst .5 ppg players. The injury carousel really hurt his numbers.
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
it’s a bummer, but you expect slumps from a 2nd year player. as DDC and the rest have said multiple times, they’re grading on a curve. for a 2nd year player, leading your team in scoring while facing top defensive opposition (no matter how good the team is) is way ahead of the curve. especially with the incredible winger inconsistency he had due to injury. He showed good improvement from last year as well, which was imporatnt to me — especially in the faceoff dot and defensively. And can’t you blame that slump on injury/external factors at least some?
Bottom line, he wasn’t perfect, but I expect that from a 2nd year guy. He’s got room to grow still, I agree, but he’s doing very well. I wonder what this season might have been like if he’d had Mueller or Flash for longer, and I am excited to see what happens going forward as he continues to improve.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Expectations
I think people have shifted their season-ending expectations to fit the player. I think if you looked in the Archives most people expected at least a 70 point season from Duchene. and an A is about exceeding expectations
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BOOM!
Most people DID expect at least 70 points from Duchene this season. So how can we claim retroactively that he exceeded expectations. And yes, that poll is giving you the finger.
(Love the Archives)
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 10:26 AM MDT up reply actions
Someone take away his key to the archives.
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
So people expected 70 pts from him with the belief that he’d have a solid line with which to work, right? He essentially hit that mark with an inconsistent line and a bunch of bottom-6ers and call-ups. I’d say that turns into exceeding expectations since expectations HAVE to be adjusted based on circumstances. You can’t ignore the issues with injuries and overall team crappiness when doing the grade. That has to be factored in.
So, hitting nearly 70 pts despite having a tragically worse situation than expected would seem to me exceeding expectations. But perhaps that’s just me.
Thank you, Footer. You - and your nose - will never be forgotten.
Avalanche Breakaway: a blog of hockey goodness
by Cheryl Bradley on May 11, 2011 10:35 AM MDT up reply actions
Mueller was already hurt for the season when this was written. So which winger were they expecting him to play with at this point?
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 10:45 AM MDT up reply actions
You would have to ask them. But I would be willing to bet they didn’t think it would be Kevin Porter, Mark Olver or Greg Mauldin.
Thank you, Footer. You - and your nose - will never be forgotten.
Avalanche Breakaway: a blog of hockey goodness
by Cheryl Bradley on May 11, 2011 10:53 AM MDT up reply actions
Here’s my newest blog post in which I breakdown why Duchene didn’t deserve an A- The “poor wingers” excuse is, IMO kind of flimsy. (unless we’re admitting that all our wings suck, in which case I’d ask if people think Duchene did such a great job, why did they think he’d get 75-80 points this season, on average?)
I took it a step further, here’s the breakdown of Wingers Duchene played with all season, and the number of games he played on their line (or at least started) (according to the MHH line chart):
Hejduk 52
Jones 26
Fleischman 19
Olver 11
Porter 9
Yip 9
Winnik 9
Stewart 5
Stastny 3
Stoa 2
Forsberg 2
Mauldin 1
McLeod 1
McClement 1
Granted there’s a healthy dose of Yip, Porter,and Olver in there, but Duchene spent most of his time with Hejduk, Jones, and Fleischman.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 10:57 AM MDT up reply actions
And during the time he had Hejduk, Jones, and or Flash on his wing, what were his point totals?
A man who stole my whisky used the defense that no one could resist a bottle of Scotch. I had no choice but to testify on his behalf.
That would take a lot more research.
In my post I point out that during his “slump” (7pts in 22 games) his most common line mates were Hejduk & Jones, followed by Stewart and Porter.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 11:06 AM MDT up reply actions
it blows my mind he spent so much time with Jones. It could not have been more obvious that those 2 don’t work together. SACCO!!!
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Yeah
but what was the alternative? He spent a ton of time with Hejduk, and the alternative is Stewart or…. Porter, Yip?
And if you rob Stastny of Stewart who the hell would he have played with?
Buiggest problem: The Avs wings, minus Hejduk, Stewart Jones and Fleischman really kind of suck.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 11:16 AM MDT up reply actions
and Mueller. Galiardi’s loss/lostness hurt too.
It does all suck in terms of the options. I’m objecting more to the times he didn’t have to play Jones with Duchene. I would have moved RoR up to wing or Duchene to wing much sooner, personally.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
I agree with you there. I think Duchene should have been moved to LW with Stastny and Hejduk after Stewart was traded. Your best players should almost always be playing together.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 11:30 AM MDT up reply actions
that might have worked then you have Olver, O’R, Jones on the second (asuming you would keep Hedjuk on that 1st line. Only that 2nd doesn’t scare anyone. Considering where they ended up it might not have hurt to try it.
Each of my replies is a work of art, each more brilliant than the last.
by An Unmitigated Disaster on May 11, 2011 4:50 PM MDT up reply actions
you guys know those stats are available, right? you just need to scroll up.
I am the most humble blogger of all time
by David Driscoll-Carignan on May 11, 2011 11:35 AM MDT up reply actions
Like I said, who reads the posts
/sheepish
It is interesting that other than Maybe Yip, his point production seems fairly consistent regardless of teammate. Small sample size caveat obviously in effect here.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 11:40 AM MDT up reply actions
Another tried and true MHH staple!
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
by A.J. Haefele on May 11, 2011 1:36 PM MDT up reply actions
You’ll notice my comments aren’t in there. those weren’t my expectations.
there’s expectations and there’s expectations. those are preseason wishing and hoping expectations for one guy, assuming everything went right. it didn’t, and those were pretty unrealistic imo.
then there’s expectations for a more generic guy, based on his role and growth. I guess that’s what I’m grading by. I hoped for about this output from Duchene but didn’t expect it, and that was with better linemates. he still did it with less, and i thought his defense and faceoffs improved markedly as well, more than I expected.
are you just saying that because he “only” met these expectations he deserves less? or are you saying you expected more from him?
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
how about this: i thought Duchene was A (exceeding expectations) for 58 games, and a C (below expectations) for 22. weighted GPA avg: 3.45. Almost exactly between a B+ and a A-. Given the injury issues and hardships Duchene and the team faced, I go with A-.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
then there’s expectations for a more generic guy, based on his role and growth. I guess that’s what I’m grading by. I hoped for about this output from Duchene but didn’t expect it, and that was with better linemates. he still did it with less, and i thought his defense and faceoffs improved markedly as well, more than I expected.
So you’re grading Duchene on the curve of an average player? That’s fine (although that’s not what the authors here have done). And if that’s your criteria an A makes sense. Would you give Stastny an A? He played with worse wingers, against tougher competition, and outperformed almost every one of his peers too.
But no, I think he met expectations, but he didn’t exceed them by any stretch. I expected him to have more points, I expected him to be better, and I expected him to have ~70 pts. (I realize I said 102 in that article, but tongue was planted firmly in my cheek). He progressed exactly as I had expected he would. To me, that’s a B
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 11:13 AM MDT up reply actions
don't put words in my mouth
i said role and growth. Part of that is vs the avg 2nd line center, part of that is based on where Duchene alone has been, is and such.
Duchene was a killer 2nd line center. He’s incredibly young still. He still has untapped potential. Certainly expectations are much higher than Joe Draftee, but I don’t agree with grading him on the Sidney Crosby scale like you seem to be.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
but I don’t agree with grading him on the Sidney Crosby scale like you seem to be.
don’t put words in my mouth
Ditto.
I am grading him on a second year player with elite talent scale. Stamkos had 102 points his second year. Malkin had 106. Toews had 70, but was monumentally better defensively. Eric Staal had 100. M. Richards in his second full season had 76, and was better defensively. Kopitar had 77. Stastny had 71
These are the players I expect Duchene to be mentioned in the same breath as someday. I expect him to be better than Kopitar and Sastny someday. I expect him to be as good as Eric Staal someday. I don’t think these expectations are out of line with anyone else on this site. Well, based on these expectations Duchene was about where he should be. Which is fine. There’s nothing wrong with that. Like I said in my post, he deserves a B. A B is not a bad grade.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
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by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 11:27 AM MDT up reply actions
cherry picking examples…come on. that’s what I mean by the Crosby scale. here’s more #1 picks I expect Duchene to be mentioned in the same breath with:
tavares: 67p
kane: 70p
kovy: 66p
nash: 57p
lecavalier: 67p
Thornton: 60p
(note: stefan, 31p, heh)
and that’s just #1 overalls — a scale I would say is higher than the one he deserves. Duchene is tracking just fine even on that scale.
here’s #2 and #3 forwards as well from the recent past (skipping busts):
2:
JVR: 40p
J. Staal: 28p
Malkin: 106p
Spezza: 55p
Ryan: 57p
Heatley: 89p
D. Sedin: 32p
3:
H sedin: 36p
Horton: 47p
Turris (maybe bust?): 25p
E. Kane: 43p
You know, I might even say Duchene is exceeding expectations for a #3 pick. by a lot.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Of course I cherry-picked those. By definition I was making a list of elite (A-worthy) second year performances. The only way to make that list is to cherry-pick the elite performances.
And I’m not judging Duchene based upon place taken in the draft, by that scale he gets an A. Of course, by that scale Brian Eliott gets an A+++++++++++++++++++. And David Jones gets a letter that scientists have yet to discover that’s before three other letters they also have yet to discover.
Look the scale being used was, in general, based upon the expectations coming into the season for (Player) how did he do? I take issue with Duchene getting an A- because the expectations this community, in general (and authors of this blog at the time) set for him were 75+ points ± 10. He just met expectations, how is that An A-? To me, that’s a B to B+.
Your grading scale seems different. It seems like your scale is “Based upon other 2nd year players with his talent”. That’s fine and that’s a different scale. I know you think the world of Duchene and think he will be an exemplary player.
Of these 30 players plus some injured ones who obviously would be on this list (Malkin and Zetterberg specifically) How did his second year stack up?
A lot Better than:
Sedin, Kesler, Carter, Grabovski, Plekanic, Ruutu, Dubinsky, Zetterberg
Slightly better than
Getzlaf, Ribiero, Pavelski, M. Koivu
About The Same:
Thornton, Tavares, Krejci, Datsyuk, Bergeron, Stastny, Lecavalier
Slightly worse than:
Toews, Kopitar, Richards,
Definitely worse than:
Stamkos, Crosby, Malkin, E. Staal, Crosby, Backstrom, Spezza
(I didn’t count 1/3 of seasons, I counted 2nd season after their first nearly full season)
So he’s right in line with the top 30 or so scoring forwards usually are in this stage of their careers. (I have to add that Thornton and Lecavalier played their second season at the height of the Clutch & Grab). He’s on track to have a very very good career and be a very very good player.
But his season is almost exactly the average of the top 30 scoring centers this season (minus the two rookies on that list, Skinner and Coture). If you think that’s deserving of an A-… I mean i guess it’s your grade, but I’d take issue with it.
If it’s some sort of different scale, then I have no idea what you’re grading on. Because as far as I can tell it’s kind of a hybrid of the above two. And I don’t think he deserves an A- on either one of them.
If the scale is “#3 Draft pick” then I agree with an A.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 1:56 PM MDT up reply actions
“Based upon other 2nd year players with his talent” yeah, that’s pretty close. Also his age, the role they were in, and vs. the performance expected in general of that role. Duchene is younger than most comparable draft picks, and playing a bigger role (drawing top pairing opposition, etc.).
that link goes nowhere for me. i assume it’s the top 30 scorers in the league over the last few years? regardless, i like the list. it shows Duchene is right on schedule…if he was years older like most of those guys, and probably not facing top pairing opposition.
he’s doing better than most #3 picks. he’s in a bigger role than most “comparables” in terms of stars at this point. he’s doing really well relative to the team situation this past year. so, what you’re taking issue with is not exactly my metric. I’m trying to look at a complete picture, not narrow statistical windows.
To flip your comment around, I take issue with you glossing over all of the other circumstances around his performance and boiling it down to points vs. other stars at this stage and a nasty slump.
i guess if there’s one thing this data shows, 2nd year performance is not a great predictor of eventual production/value.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
It’s supposed to be the top 30 center scorers for this season on NHL.com.
ahem if you read my blog you’d know Stastny, not Duchene, faced the top-pair more a lot more often.
To flip your comment around, I take issue with you glossing over all of the other circumstances around his performance and boiling it down to points vs. other stars at this stage and a nasty slump.
My problem is that a lot of people used these circumstances, and I don’t think they’re true, but they’re just excuses to give Duchene the grade they want to give him. What I really see is a lot of glossing over Duchene’s weaknesses because they like him.
“He faced top pair opposition”, but mostly he didn’t, Stastny did.
“He had awful line mates” But he was most commonly paired with Hejduk, Fleischman and Jones, which is about as good as the Avs can do.
“He exceeded expectations this season” But he didn’t. He met them (at least based on what fans thought)
The only one that I think is really solid is “He’s only 19”. That does give him a bump, because it’s pretty special. That he’s so good for so young is a great omen for the future. It’s also probably why I gave him a “B” as opposed to a “B-”.
What it really boils down to is that you’re a cupcake grader, and I’m a hardass.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 2:39 PM MDT up reply actions
It’s supposed to be the top 30 center scorers for this season on NHL.com.
ahem if you read my blog you’d know Stastny, not Duchene, faced the top-pair more a lot more often.
actually, that number probably shows Stastny was matched against other top lines more, as qualcomp is +/- based, yes? typically, it’s forwards with gaudy +/-, not so much defenders. And while I don’t exactly have numbers to back it up, but I saw an awful lot of top defensive pairings pitted against Duchene’s line, especially as the season went on. You may be right that Stastny saw more over the course of the season, but that’s not what I took away.
My problem is that a lot of people used these circumstances, and I don’t think they’re true, but they’re just excuses to give Duchene the grade they want to give him. What I really see is a lot of glossing over Duchene’s weaknesses because they like him.
trust me, i see them. once again to flip that around, I see people being much harder on Duchene because they like him, or because they think everyone else is being too easy on him. for example, going out of their way to cherry pick crazy good comparables. :)
"He faced top pair opposition", but mostly he didn’t, Stastny did.
disagree, as stated above.
"He had awful line mates" But he was most commonly paired with Hejduk, Fleischman and Jones, which is about as good as the Avs can doI’m sorry, my expectation was for more still. Instead injuries forced Jones, whom he clearly doesn’t work well with as we discussed, to be on his most common line. He only had 20 games of Flash, and 50 of Hejduk. the other 90 winger games were, well, pretty poor fare. I expected that his wingers would be at least HALF guys worth a damn, wouldn’t you?
"He exceeded expectations this season" But he didn’t. He met them (at least based on what fans thought)I’ll agree with that. It’s only relative to adversity and the other listed factors that i say he exceeded expectations.
The only one that I think is really solid is "He’s only 19". That does give him a bump, because it’s pretty special. That he’s so good for so young is a great omen for the future. It’s also probably why I gave him a "B" as opposed to a "B-".
What it really boils down to is that you’re a cupcake grader, and I’m a hardass.
So meeting expectation is a B-? I consider that a B (by our f’ed up grading standards today).
I think it boils down to that you’re trying to be a negative nancy as usual because you think that makes you more objective. WHAT NOW?! :) seriously, you do have that bias. you like being a hardass, as you say. it’s still a bias.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
actually, that number probably shows Stastny was matched against other top lines more, as qualcomp is +/- based, yes?
It’s Corsi based, yes. And defensemen mix in with Forwards in Corsi pretty evenly, I think.
trust me, i see them. once again to flip that around, I see people being much harder on Duchene because they like him, or because they think everyone else is being too easy on him.
Other than me, a little, and those idiots that have a grudge against him in the DP comments, who has been tough on Duchene? Other than Dan a little and Red below a little I haven’t seen any reasonable critiques of Duchene this season besides the one here?
I’m sorry, my expectation was for more still. Instead injuries forced Jones, whom he clearly doesn’t work well with as we discussed, to be on his most common line. He only had 20 games of Flash, and 50 of Hejduk. the other 90 winger games were, well, pretty poor fare. I expected that his wingers would be at least HALF guys worth a damn, wouldn’t you?
I still would count Jones as worth a damn, even if they didn’t work well together. I might give Duchene a pass on that this season, but if he’s going to be this elite talent, he’s gotta be able to play with guys. Especially wingers that put up 27 goals. (And with Jones on his wing Duchene had 25 points in 29 games, so even though it was awkward, they did produce some together.)
I think it boils down to that you’re trying to be a negative nancy as usual because you think that makes you more objective. WHAT NOW?! :) seriously, you do have that bias. you like being a hardass, as you say. it’s still a bias
I do have a bias, but it’s not a negative nancy one. And it’s certainly not to seem more objective. It’s a centrist bias.
I see sports fandom as irrationality at it’s best, but there are times when that irrationality affects people’s judgement of players. When praise, or scorn, is almost near universal I find it a bit much and try to look at a player and see if people are missing something. OR if they’re seeing ghosts that aren’t there. When there’s nearly universal praise, or scorn, of a player It sends a trigger in my head to look at it more carefully.
Usually when a player is getting piled on there’s good things they are doing that people miss completely because they only want to see the bad (i.e. Quincey). He had a couple unlucky plays and there was talk of shipping him out for a bag of pucks. Even the more rational people here wanted him benched in favor of… I’m not sure. I hardly think I was being negative Nancy there. He was playing below par, but peple were certainly missing the good things he was doing too.
I felt the same way about Anderson: people were made an observation until it snowballed into a bit of groupthink. I certainly think there was some stuff going on there, but I thought the level of assumption was well out of hand.
Likewise, I thought Duchene got a bit of a pass for his poor 2 month stretch. I mean, .32PPG is not a number Duchene should ever see for more than about 10 games. I truly thought he was abysmal for 2 months. I didn’t notice it at first, but when I dug in It made me notice. The reason I dug in was because no one was criticizing him, and I thought it bizarre, but I’m not being contrarian for the sake of it.
Of course, there was near universal hatred of Hunwick for a time too, and I dug deeper there. What I found was that everyone was pretty much right: he was sucking it up. And I said so.
So I’ll freely, and proudly, admit a centrist bias, which is where a lot of my opinions come from.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 12, 2011 12:28 AM MDT up reply actions
Subthread summary below:
2010-2011 Colorado Avalanche: Hugging the cap floor and waiting on their revenue share, because hey, billionaires need welfare too!
I don’t think it was a fight. We had a spirited debate.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 12, 2011 11:39 AM MDT up reply actions
indeed, no fight here.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
I am yanking your respective chains and find the primary point of conflict (does he deserve an A- or a B+) to be mildly amusing.
2010-2011 Colorado Avalanche: Hugging the cap floor and waiting on their revenue share, because hey, billionaires need welfare too!
A- or B to B- sir. Do not trivialize this debate
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 12, 2011 12:26 PM MDT up reply actions
I thought qualcomp was still just /-, it says right on the page. Isn’t QoC Corsi the Corsi version? Regardless, Stastny is still ahead, but that can be explained by the greater weighting of top lines (3 players) vs. top pairings (2 players) and the generally low Corsi//-of shutdown lines that Duchene faced. Plus, we know where Corsi discussions end. :)
I thought we were talking about each other in the 3rd person?
Sometimes players just don’t work together well. When I say worth a damn, I mean a “Duchene wing.” We all know it’s real. Certainly he needs to improve on that (and I think it will), but I considered the situation pretty poor in general. Way worse than I expected at the start of the year.
A centrist bias, eh. i thought the centrist bias was towards the mean opinion, not always away from it? It seems to me that you simply question the opinion of the majority in your examples. what would that be, a reverse centrist bias? and as I said, I think you like setting yourself against the majority. It is fun sometimes, I agree.
Sometimes that creates interesting insight, which I like reading from you. Here, it’s my opinion we’re seeing you looking a bit hard for an opinion to oppose the majority on.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Well I say Centrist because when I tend to question the majority opinion, It’s usually, at least in my mind, because the majority opinion has moved well past the center.
It wasn’t just you’re opinion, You, The collective MHH, Dater all gave Duchene an A-, and overall I didn’t see a whole lot of criticism of him this season even when he was strug-a-ling mightily. So I didn’t have to look very hard to find a majority opinion to question.
(I was actually a little surprised that there was at least some level of agreement with me by some people below.)
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 12, 2011 12:18 PM MDT up reply actions
You’re not a centrist, rather you’re a contrarian.
The majority may be far to one side or may be right down the middle. You seek to question the majority regardless of where it lies.
2010-2011 Colorado Avalanche: Hugging the cap floor and waiting on their revenue share, because hey, billionaires need welfare too!
I don’t see myself as Contrarian. Contrarian’s will question majority opinion no matter what. I do not do that. When I feel there’s a majority opinion that is overwhelming, I take time out to look at the underlying opinion.
Sometimes, I find I disagree with it. (Duchene A-, Quincey Sucks, Anderson quit) sometimes I agree (Hunwick sucks, Stastny had a mediocre season).
I see a contrarian as someone like Malcom Gladwell who crafts a narrative specifically designed to oppose common knowledge instead of questioning it and deciding for yourself.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 12, 2011 12:29 PM MDT up reply actions
There are intelligent contrarians (based on most evidence, including you) and those that will tilt at windmills given any opportunity. It’s all a matter of degree.
2010-2011 Colorado Avalanche: Hugging the cap floor and waiting on their revenue share, because hey, billionaires need welfare too!
I like Malachi’s “Freethinker”. It’s a little smug, but more preferable than “Contrarian”
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 12, 2011 2:49 PM MDT up reply actions
AM NOT!
2010-2011 Colorado Avalanche: Hugging the cap floor and waiting on their revenue share, because hey, billionaires need welfare too!
(I was actually a little surprised that there was at least some level of agreement with me by some people below.)
I don’t like group think either.
"In my experience, there's no such thing as luck" -Obi Wan Kenobi
I don't understand the purpose of the line, "I don't need to drink
to have fun." Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and
sticks when they've invented the lighter?
you 2 are group thinking!
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Whatever, I’m unique just like everyone else. ;)
"In my experience, there's no such thing as luck" -Obi Wan Kenobi
I don't understand the purpose of the line, "I don't need to drink
to have fun." Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and
sticks when they've invented the lighter?
You gave him a B+, I gave him a B. Obviously we are on different wavelengths.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 12, 2011 2:49 PM MDT up reply actions
well, i really thought it was mostly positive. if it helps, i certainly see areas for improvement in Duchene’s game. He needs to shoot more, especially one-timers. He needs to improve his shot accuracy a lot. His defense is trending well, but needs improvement still. His chemistry with wingers is puzzlingly random (Olver, really?). I’d like to see him find open ice without the puck on offense a lot better. I’d like to see his vanishing acts go away.
But those are mostly nitpicks, and things I expect from a 19yo 2nd year player, even a stud. that he still did so well with so much room to improve is really impressive to me.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Because 67 is different than 70?
Datsyuk may have done it first, but he learned it from Peter Forsberg.
Thanks for everything Foppa!
Footer: We'll miss seeing you clear the riff raff off your lawn.
by Americanario on May 11, 2011 1:56 PM MDT up reply actions
No
But you’re a teacher. If a student were performing up to expectations, but not exceeding them, is it an A?
That’s my only point. I’m not dogging on Duchene. He’s a great player, he had a good season. He’s on pace to be a great player. But did he exceed expectations? for 93% of Avs fans (or at least the ones who voted in that poll), that answer has to be no.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 2:04 PM MDT up reply actions
Since when do we have expectations for students? Shit I thought I was supposed to give them an A just for showing up.
No Duchene didn’t exceed expectations but it’s not like he was way under them either.
Datsyuk may have done it first, but he learned it from Peter Forsberg.
Thanks for everything Foppa!
Footer: We'll miss seeing you clear the riff raff off your lawn.
by Americanario on May 11, 2011 2:07 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
No Duchene didn’t exceed expectations but it’s not like he was way under them either.
That’s my point. And why I think a B is appropriate
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 2:09 PM MDT up reply actions
Please remember that a big part of the grade is based on the contributions the player made to the team.
Thank you, Footer. You - and your nose - will never be forgotten.
Avalanche Breakaway: a blog of hockey goodness
by Cheryl Bradley on May 11, 2011 2:31 PM MDT up reply actions
I’ll be very very interested to see how you guys graded Stastny. I thought (in general) he took a lot more flak this season (in other corners especially) than he deserved, while Duchene got a bit of a pass.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 2:41 PM MDT up reply actions
I’ll tell you my grade: B-. my expectations were higher for him than Duchene, and while the circumstances of this year really screwed him, he missed those expectations by slightly more than the adversity thrown his way would have indicated.
what’s yours, jibs?
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Probably a B- or a B. I was a bit disappointed in his play at times, but it strikes me as a fluky bad Season. I think when stuff went to crap, he got the worse end of the deal. I havenm’t done the research, but He seems to have gotten the worse teammates when things went bad (Jones over Hejduk, etc) and I think he drew the tougher defensive pairs, and I think he also drew tougher forwards too since he’s better defensively.
So overall I have Duchene at a B and Stastny at a B-
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 5:09 PM MDT up reply actions
Scratch that
probably a C+. I did expect more out of Stastny than Duchene and he did have a poor season. I think the poor linemates tougher opponents bit is more apt for him than Duchene, and his slump wasn’t nearly as bad as Duchene’s, but he is the Avs best player and he needed to do more, even with the spare parts on his line.
So i’m waivering on a B-/C+
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 5:15 PM MDT up reply actions
Wow
Did you just give an entire analysis on a guy’s season without ONCE mentioning how much money he makes? Didn’t even realize that was possible >_>
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
by A.J. Haefele on May 11, 2011 5:39 PM MDT up reply actions
Leading the Avs in scoring this year was like being the fat girl with a pretty face.
I liken the "depth" of Avalanche centers to a carton of eggs; good for you if cooked properly. Unfortunately I liken the Western Conference to a butter laden frying pan.
ouch.
Thank you, Footer. You - and your nose - will never be forgotten.
Avalanche Breakaway: a blog of hockey goodness
by Cheryl Bradley on May 11, 2011 10:35 AM MDT up reply actions
By the way
I voted other, I’d have taken Landon Ferraro
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 9:42 AM MDT reply actions
Confusing poll question
So, if you could take anyone with number 2, Tavarez was already gone, so why is he in the poll? And we didn’t pick number 2, we picked 3rd, so are we picking for Tampa Bay, who took Hedman? Or did the poll mean to ask who you would take with the 1st pick? Very confusing.
We see a wonderful sun-soaked city nestled at the foot of the Rocky Mountains. Enos sees nickels and dimes.
by Bob in Boulder on May 11, 2011 10:33 AM MDT reply actions
It’s assuming the Red Wings will have taken the best player, no matter where they drafted.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 10:34 AM MDT up reply actions
On conference call….Hejduk re-signed this morning. no details on type of contract.
Thank you, Footer. You - and your nose - will never be forgotten.
Avalanche Breakaway: a blog of hockey goodness
by Cheryl Bradley on May 11, 2011 11:04 AM MDT reply actions
Yay.
Winnik is a fucking #Winner. Le P'tit Français est un Des Boys. Can Johnson bring me loads of happiness? Bucket Loads. Ryan O`Byrne must have #TigerBlood
Because 30 is different than 20.
by Sandie Gauthier on May 11, 2011 11:10 AM MDT up reply actions
1y, 2.6 + .4 in bonuses, fyi.
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
Thanks! I will add that to my recap.
Thank you, Footer. You - and your nose - will never be forgotten.
Avalanche Breakaway: a blog of hockey goodness
by Cheryl Bradley on May 11, 2011 1:21 PM MDT up reply actions
Sigh Avs
Avs called and just invited me to the Q & A session. Nice job in planning.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 11:16 AM MDT reply actions
At least they eventually remembered you. </glass half full>
Is the invite because of your blog?
by Inebriated Simian Miscreants on May 11, 2011 12:12 PM MDT up reply actions
They invited me based upon the 14 game pack my wife and I bought.
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 1:23 PM MDT up reply actions
Fricken work interrupted my opportunity to get in on the conference call. Dammit. I would appreciate any other updates. Hopefully they are getting a decent deal on the duke to save room for all of the big FAs they will sign …. LOFL.
We see a wonderful sun-soaked city nestled at the foot of the Rocky Mountains. Enos sees nickels and dimes.
by Bob in Boulder on May 11, 2011 11:43 AM MDT reply actions
Made a long ass post with details.
Thank you, Footer. You - and your nose - will never be forgotten.
Avalanche Breakaway: a blog of hockey goodness
by Cheryl Bradley on May 11, 2011 1:23 PM MDT up reply actions
This is not a jibble. There were just too many other places to put this comment so I decided to start a new line of thought with it.
I don’t think I buy the “Duchene struggles when he has bad wingers” argument. For one, it’s been shown that he spent most of the season with Duke and jones. For another, based on what most peoples expectations are for him, he needs to make his wingers better, not have who he plays with drag him down. I can think of two other centers in Avs history, whose names have been mentioned with Dutchy, and I don’t believe either of them ever needed any excuses such as bad wingers. Now, those two guys didn’t have bad wingers very often, but they always made whoever they played with better, and even when they had less than stellar linemates they dominated.
I guess basically what I am saying is that imo he needs to be dominant no matter who he plays with, especially to deserve an A. I think I would have gone with a B+ because of his slump.
I also realize he’s still pretty young and I expect him to get better. Especially as he’ll be the top line center once we trade Statsny away and let Hishon take over as second line center. hurpa durpa.
"In my experience, there's no such thing as luck" -Obi Wan Kenobi
I don't understand the purpose of the line, "I don't need to drink
to have fun." Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and
sticks when they've invented the lighter?
by TheRed on May 11, 2011 11:56 AM MDT reply actions 1 recs
Especially as he’ll be the top line center once we trade Statsny away
For Kadri!
Avalanche Shutouts are a powerful Aphrodisiac
Jibblescribbits: C'mon over and waste some time
by Jibblescribbits on May 11, 2011 11:57 AM MDT up reply actions
I agree with this post.
by Inebriated Simian Miscreants on May 11, 2011 12:14 PM MDT up reply actions
Come on now, Red
The ‘bad linemates’ excuse is a tried and true MHH staple.
Totally agree with you, btw. I didn’t give him an A =)
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
by A.J. Haefele on May 11, 2011 1:35 PM MDT up reply actions
The ‘bad linemates’ excuse is a tried and true MHH staple.
I know. And it’s kind of old, imo. Maybe that doesn’t come across very clear in my ramblings (I know you get it), but it seems like some things just get repeated until everyone takes them for granted.
"In my experience, there's no such thing as luck" -Obi Wan Kenobi
I don't understand the purpose of the line, "I don't need to drink
to have fun." Great, no one does. But why start a fire with flint and
sticks when they've invented the lighter?
From Conan last night
In Detroit, a plane had to be diverted due to a threatening note. The note said, "Welcome to Detroit."
We see a wonderful sun-soaked city nestled at the foot of the Rocky Mountains. Enos sees nickels and dimes.
by Bob in Boulder on May 11, 2011 12:10 PM MDT reply actions
height
Mr. David sir, SB Nation and NHL.com both have Dutchy’s height listed at 5’11" instead of 5’9".
I’m a bit embarrassed to have known that off the top of my head.
I was wondering the same thing. I always thought he was just under 6’.
Thanks, Joe... Thanks, Peter.... Thanks, Adam....
Is that with or without skates?
Datsyuk may have done it first, but he learned it from Peter Forsberg.
Thanks for everything Foppa!
Footer: We'll miss seeing you clear the riff raff off your lawn.
by Americanario on May 11, 2011 2:03 PM MDT up reply actions
Two extra two inches do matter.
Winnik is a fucking #Winner. Le P'tit Français est un Des Boys. Can Johnson bring me loads of happiness? Bucket Loads. Ryan O`Byrne must have #TigerBlood
Because 30 is different than 20.
by Sandie Gauthier on May 11, 2011 12:59 PM MDT up reply actions
*those extra
Winnik is a fucking #Winner. Le P'tit Français est un Des Boys. Can Johnson bring me loads of happiness? Bucket Loads. Ryan O`Byrne must have #TigerBlood
Because 30 is different than 20.
by Sandie Gauthier on May 11, 2011 12:59 PM MDT up reply actions
B
Can’t be more than that. We lived through his brutal stretch when he just wasn’t producing when he was paired with the best wingers.
He’s young, but that’s a pretty hefty salary. Also, I expected more improvement from him than I saw.
Being famous and having a fender bender is weird. You want to be upset but the other drivers just thrilled & giddy that it's you. — Dane Cook
by Dan Winkler on May 11, 2011 4:56 PM MDT via mobile reply actions
"I’m predicting 50pts in the NHL for Hensick next season. Anyone want to put $20 on it?" - DetAvs, Jun 18, 2010 3:45 AM EDT
Hensick stats: 13 games, 1g/2a/3p THOMAS/DETAVS: I WANT MY $20
by thedoctor on May 11, 2011 5:10 PM MDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah
How dare he improve in nearly every facet of his game but NOT do it at the pace you’d like. What a fucking scrub.
And cap hit does not equal salary. His salary, according to CG, was $900,000. What kind of effect would that have on your grade?
A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.
by A.J. Haefele on May 11, 2011 5:42 PM MDT up reply actions
Its my opinion, not sure where the extra dose of dickishness is coming from.
Being famous and having a fender bender is weird. You want to be upset but the other drivers just thrilled & giddy that it's you. — Dane Cook
by Dan Winkler on May 11, 2011 6:14 PM MDT via mobile up reply actions
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